Homosexual Christian? Religious zealots, some church officials and a portion of society seem to think that such a combination of words would be a paradox, blasphemy, an enigma. On a simple, first line of defense level – the fact that any self-proclaimed example of faith would condemn a homosexual only shows the person as a hypocrite by their own definition. The Bible is a widely available and well known publication. It does not take a religious fanatic to read or interpret any part of it. The very basis of many Christian teachings lies in not passing judgment on others. By condemning a homosexual, even the most righteous person of faith not only discredits themselves, but Christianity as a whole.
I have nothing but respect for a person who lives their life according to their faith. Faith is hard to attain, hard to maintain, and too easily broken. Perhaps if the members of the religious community who spend so much time, effort and anger on the condemnation of homosexuals instead lived their lives according to the teachings in the Bible – their evangelical missions would be more effective. Live your life as you believe is morally right, as your faith guides you. Exhibit the Christian qualities that Jesus would have encouraged. Bring people to your faith with love, understanding and acceptance.
The wonderful thing about the Bible is it is an exceptional source of learning and moral guidance. There are parables and verses that can be applied to a multitude of situation. This is what makes the Bible an effective moral compass even in the modern day and age. But it must be used with caution – five different people could read the exact same thing and interpret it in ten different ways. Each of us brings our own life experience and background – and we can all use the Bible to guide us, but that doesn’t mean what you interpret will be the same interpretation I get out of something.
And of course, there will be the hard core, holier than thou types who want to argue a literal interpretation of the Bible. To these people, I can only point out that if you are going to assert a literal interpretation of scriptures condemning a homosexual for being “with a male as with a woman,” then I hope your parents (or your wife’s parents) are able to produce the bloody sheets from your first night as husband and wife – as a proof of your virginity. And if not, hopefully you’re prepared for the stoning that – according to the scripture – will follow. (Deuteronomy 22)
Morals and ethics will continue to have commonalities from history through the coming eras. Using scriptures as a moral compass could help guide the next generations through changing times. However, using the scriptures to justify your hatred, fear and prejudice will destroy the sanctity of the writings. The world is changing on a daily basis. The standard and accepted structure of a family unit is evolving. The moral guidance behind what a family is need not be left behind; however, the hatred and condemnations thrown about by individuals in the name of religion will lead to the demise of the Christian community.
See also: http://ryantravis.wordpress.com/2008/08/12/homosexual-gift/
Tags: adultery, biblical, bigot, christian, fornication, gay, homosexual, morality, paradox, priest, queer, religion, sodomy
August 20, 2008 at 8:24 am
==Homosexual Christian? Religious zealots, some church officials and a portion of society seem to think that such a combination of words would be a paradox, blasphemy, an enigma. ==
No, just an oxymoron.
==[The Bible] does not take a religious fanatic to read or interpret any part of it.==
It takes only the Holy Spirit.
== The very basis of many Christian teachings lies in not passing judgment on others.==
What the Word of God says is that the UNRIGHTEOUS are not to judge others. The Word of God says that the Righteous, through faith in Jesus, are to judge and to rebuke according to the Standard of the Word.
== By condemning a homosexual, even the most righteous person of faith not only discredits themselves, but Christianity as a whole.==
Except that Jesus said that those who do not adhere to His teaching are condemned already. That saves us that step.
==Faith is…hard to maintain…==
Not for those who love God through Jesus.
==… and too easily broken.==
The doubleminded are easily drawn into sin.
==…five different people could read the exact same thing and interpret it in ten different ways.==
The Devil likes it that way. The fault is in the private interpretation.
Fortunately, we can go to the Word and check the rest of Scripture to see whose interpretation is correct.
== Each of us brings our own life experience and background – and we can all use the Bible to guide us, but that doesn’t mean what you interpret will be the same interpretation I get out of something.==
Your agenda helps you avoid proper interpretation of It.
==…if you are going to assert a literal interpretation of scriptures condemning a homosexual for being “with a male as with a woman,” then I hope your parents (or your wife’s parents) are able to produce the bloody sheets from your first night as husband and wife – as a proof of your virginity. ==
So, you’re arguning that those who are born again and under Grace should adhere to condemnation under the Law, that Jesus’s coming was in vain?
That “law,” in any case, is a Jewish custom and not directed at Man.
Scoffers don’t understand that God sometimes talks to the Jews and sometimes to Man, and that there is the Commandment, the commandment, the Law and the law, the statute, ordinances and rules and regulations.
==And if not, hopefully you’re prepared for the stoning that – according to the scripture – will follow. (Deuteronomy 22)==
Jesus dispensed with that, under Grace — that is, for those who are born again.
Being borfn again changes your want-to’s. You want not to sin. You want to stop sinning. Those who claim to be homosexual want the best of both worlds — lukewarm and one foot in and one foot out. That doesn’t happen without God’s wrath.
Today, the “Stone” of the Commandments is thrown.
==…using the scriptures to justify your hatred…==
You people must characterize what we report from the Word of God as “hatred” in order to try to justify your choice of the homosexual, alternative-lifestyle orientation option. Heterophobes are the ones who hate.
==… fear and prejudice will destroy the sanctity of the writings.==
In Canada, the Homosexual Militia has already done that. It’s not gonna happen here.
August 20, 2008 at 9:01 am
==The very basis of many Christian teachings lies in not passing judgment on others.==
“Many Christian teachings”???
I agree that far too many today are just like John’s apostles who went to Jesus asking, “Are You the One, or are we to look for another?”
Anyways, where do you find this teaching that lies in “not passing judgment on others”? Careful, though. First read the verse you wanna try to use, and, then, read the verses around it to see whether it refers to whom and what you plan to say the verse refers. I gotta hunch that you haven’t done that yet cuz the verse I think you’re gonna use doesn’t say what you think it says. But go ahead.
August 20, 2008 at 9:30 am
“No, just an oxymoron.”
–So you’re willing to assert that because I am a homosexual, I cannot be a Christian? Show me one Christian who has not sinned and we’ll talk, until then – try to show me anywhere in the New Testament that lets you prioritize and assign different levels of evil to individual sins–
“What the Word of God says is that the UNRIGHTEOUS are not to judge others. The Word of God says that the Righteous, through faith in Jesus, are to judge and to rebuke according to the Standard of the Word.”
–Unrighteous being defined as sinful. Perhaps you are the one?”
== By condemning a homosexual, even the most righteous person of faith not only discredits themselves, but Christianity as a whole.==
“Except that Jesus said that those who do not adhere to His teaching are condemned already. That saves us that step.”
–I challenge you to show me where Jesus said anything about homosexuality because I promise – He did not. He had plenty to say on divorce and adultery – and I’m sure you don’t spend nearly this amount of time condemning those–
==… and too easily broken.==
“The doubleminded are easily drawn into sin.”
–We are all easily drawn to sin – it is human nature–
== Each of us brings our own life experience and background – and we can all use the Bible to guide us, but that doesn’t mean what you interpret will be the same interpretation I get out of something.==
“Your agenda helps you avoid proper interpretation of It.”
–Does it? One could say the same for your hatred–
==…if you are going to assert a literal interpretation of scriptures condemning a homosexual for being “with a male as with a woman,” then I hope your parents (or your wife’s parents) are able to produce the bloody sheets from your first night as husband and wife – as a proof of your virginity. ==
“So, you’re arguning that those who are born again and under Grace should adhere to condemnation under the Law, that Jesus’s coming was in vain?”
–That would be your arguemnt also – if you’re saying it’s impossible for someone to be homosexual and Christian. Are my sins worse than yours? And again, if you’re going to use the New Testament only – the show me where Jesus Himself says anything about homosexuality–
“That “law,” in any case, is a Jewish custom and not directed at Man.”
–Custom or not, it is written in the scripture – what does that make it?–
Being borfn again changes your want-to’s. You want not to sin. You want to stop sinning. Those who claim to be homosexual want the best of both worlds — lukewarm and one foot in and one foot out. That doesn’t happen without God’s wrath. –Make up your mind, are we going with God’s wrath or Jesus’ grace?–
==…using the scriptures to justify your hatred…==
You people must characterize what we report from the Word of God as “hatred” in order to try to justify your choice of the homosexual, alternative-lifestyle orientation option. Heterophobes are the ones who hate.
–It’s nice that you get to pick and choose which parts you’re going to use–
==… fear and prejudice will destroy the sanctity of the writings.==
“In Canada, the Homosexual Militia has already done that. It’s not gonna happen here.”
–Believe it or not, the homosexual community does not spend nearly as much time and energy as you do trying to condemn others and their beliefs. –
August 20, 2008 at 9:32 am
http://ryantravis.wordpress.com/2008/08/12/homosexual-gift/
August 20, 2008 at 9:36 am
==So you’re willing to assert that because I am a homosexual, I cannot be a Christian?==
Not only willing, but do, according to the Word of God.
== Show me one Christian who has not sinned…==
Irrelevant. Those who are born again are not guilty, if they repent after mistakes. More to the point, those who are born again have changed their want-to’s, unlike those who claim to be homosexual.
==…show me anywhere in the New Testament that lets you prioritize and assign different levels of evil to individual sins==
I haven’t claimed authority to prioritize and assign them. It’s done already. All I gotta do is report what the Word of God says.
August 20, 2008 at 9:38 am
==Unrighteous being defined as sinful. ==
No. Unrighteous as in not having been born again.
==Perhaps you are the one?==
No, thanks, but I’m born again now over five years. I’m Righteous by faith in God through Jesus.
August 20, 2008 at 9:52 am
==I challenge you to show me where Jesus said anything about homosexuality because I promise – He did not.==
Then, you have broken your promise.
Jesus was God on Earth. Where God condcemns what we now call “homosexuality,” Jesus condemns it.
== He had plenty to say on divorce and adultery – and I’m sure you don’t spend nearly this amount of time condemning those.==
Divorceés and adulterers/adultresses are not trying to impose their agenda on the rest of us, trying to change this society, this culture and this country. So, there’s no need to spend as much time on them, though they are just as condemned.
==“Your agenda helps you avoid proper interpretation of It.”
–Does it? One could say the same for your hatred–==
Except I don’t hate. You assign hatred to us in order to justify your trying to impose your agenda on us.
==Are my sins worse than yours?==
Yes, cuz, thanks to Grace and my change of want-to’s, I am not guilty. You, on the other hand, continue to practice what God calls an “abomination.”
==And again, if you’re going to use the New Testament only – the show me where Jesus Himself says anything about homosexuality–==
In Leviticus, as God.
==We are all easily drawn to sin – it is human nature–==
It is the sin nature that is not dead in any of us. However, those who are born again are dead to the sin nature. If one is not walking with the LORD, the sin nature is more easily in control of that person. The sin nature is not in control of those who are born again.
==Custom or not, it is written in the scripture – what does that make it?–==
The Devi’s words are written in Scripture, too. Are they the words of God, except His reporting of what the Devil said? Of course not.
Not everything written in the Word of God is of God. There are statements made by the Devil, and they are not God’s statements.
Anyways, trhere are things that God insisted those who reject Him do, thinks like not wearing mixed fibers. That’s not for Mankind, rather for the Jews, and I ain’t a Jew.
==It’s nice that you get to pick and choose which parts you’re going to use==
That’s what YOU are doing, and that’s the MO of those who claim to be homosexual.
I am using the authoritative method of Scripture upon Scripture which is Holy Spirit interpretation, for no Scripture is of private interpretation. Thus, what I have written is backed up by a line of scriptural thought.
==…the homosexual community does not spend nearly as much time and energy as you do trying to condemn others and their beliefs…==
God says, in His Word, that they are condemned already. I merely report what He says.
August 20, 2008 at 10:18 am
==Are my sins worse than yours?==
If you continue to practice homosexuality, defying God and His Word on the subject, you do so willingly and willfully, and you don’t repent of it; and, even if you do, you just go out and do it again, and, so, He knows you don’t mean it. So, yes, your guilt is continual/continuous in willful and willing disobedience. He doesn’t treat the disobedient the same as he treats the obedient.
Those who are born again are not guilty of mistakes, IF, in honest heart, they repent of them immediately. If, like those who claim to be homosexual, they are willfully and willingly disobeying God, even though they repent, they are guilty.
So, it’s a matter of being guilty, or not guilty, regardless of the number of sins. Separation from Him is separation.
August 20, 2008 at 10:19 am
As I said, those who are born again have changed their want-to’s. Those who claim to be homosexual have not.
August 20, 2008 at 10:42 am
I know I’m wasting my time in this debate as some people will forever remain a prisoner of their fears and hatred. But to clarify:
In response to my assertion that you should be prepared to produce bloody sheets, prove your spouse was a virgin at marriage – you argue
“So, you’re arguning that those who are born again and under Grace should adhere to condemnation under the Law, that Jesus’s coming was in vain?”
Yet later, you claim that
“Jesus was God on Earth. Where God condcemns what we now call “homosexuality,” Jesus condemns it.”
So first we go with the we’re saved theory and then when it’s convenienet for your argument you go back to the Old Testament – which by the way, never uses the word homosexuality, and in fact never refers to women with women.
And I never claimed to be a “practicing” homosexual – just a homosexual. I do not need to be involved in the “practice” of homosexuality any more than you need to “practice” your heterosexuality.
The constraints of your belief system and your willingness to hide your hatred and fear behind your faith probably do help you sleep well at night. And if that’s your ultimate goal in life – to feel good about yourself, then you’ll probably be successful. But if you had any intention of bringing people to your faith, of advancing Christianity – your antiquated methods of brimstone, fire and God’s wrath are destined to fail.
August 20, 2008 at 11:04 am
==I know I’m wasting my time in this debate as some people will forever remain a prisoner of their fears and hatred. ==
WHEW! Glad that’s not me!
==In response to my assertion that you should be prepared to produce bloody sheets, prove your spouse was a virgin at marriage – you argue
“So, you’re arguning that those who are born again and under Grace should adhere to condemnation under the Law, that Jesus’s coming was in vain?”
Yet later, you claim that
“Jesus was God on Earth. Where God condcemns what we now call “homosexuality,” Jesus condemns it.”
==So first we go with the we’re saved theory and then when it’s convenienet for your argument you go back to the Old Testament …==
No, not when it’s convenient, rather when Scripture upon Scripture interpretation by the Holy Spirit applies.
==…- which by the way, never uses the word homosexuality…==
Irrelevant. God doesn’t need to use the exact word in order to get the idea across, just as in Charades wherein words aren’t even used to communicate ideas.
==..and in fact never refers to women with women. ==
Irrelevant. The idea is still communicated.
==And I never claimed to be a “practicing” homosexual – just a homosexual.==
The practice of it is fundamental to it. If you claim to be homosexual, the motion goes to homosexuality. The sin nature pushes you to that direction.
== I do not need to be involved in the “practice” of homosexuality any more than you need to “practice” your heterosexuality. ==
The practice is fundamental.
==… your willingness to hide your hatred…==
I have no hatred to hide cuz I got no hatred.
Anyways, Romans 8:1: No condemnation lands.
==… and fear behind your faith…==
The Devil makes that claim to me all the time. I ignore it cuz it’s a lie.
==…if you had any intention of bringing people to your faith, of advancing Christianity – your antiquated methods of brimstone, fire and God’s wrath are destined to fail.==
God brings them IF they choose to be led by Him. I merely report His Word. Others decide, and, on the Day of Accountability, they must answer for their decision. I’m not responsible for their decisions. They are.
August 20, 2008 at 11:06 am
==…some people will forever remain a prisoner of their fears and hatred…==
The Devil tries to work that “magic” with me all the time. It doesn’t work, and he ought to give it up with me.
Y’see, the Devil works condemnation like that, and Romans 8:1 tells me that I got nothin’ to be condemned about.
August 20, 2008 at 11:11 am
==I know I’m wasting my time …==
That’s cuz you’ve run up against somebody who won’t back down and who knows the Word, thanks to Holy Spirit interpretation, better than you.
==…if you had any intention of bringing people to your faith, of advancing Christianity – your antiquated methods of brimstone, fire and God’s wrath …==
That’s what’s involved for those not born again. Grace is in store for those who are born again, who change their want-to’s.
God does not treat the disobedient the same way He treats the obedient.
August 21, 2008 at 8:02 am
==I know I’m wasting my time in this debate …==
Then why did you bring it up? If you wanted nobody to challenge you, you should have said, up front, that you just wanted to vent your views and that you welcomed nobody else’s views. I mean, that wouldn’t have stopped me, but you could have at least told us, on the front end, that nobody has anything to say that you wanna hear.